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[Protein Engineer]

I've been doing the diet for a few days now and its definitely working for me in terms of appetite suppression. Its too soon to tell if that translates to weight loss but I can tell that I'm not as hungry and have been eating less, so the weight loss should naturally follow.  I definitely think Seth is on to something here and Im fascinated by the whole mind-body/ brain-gut axis and the concept of food-calorie association.  Having said that, I am still not fully sold on the thesis of the book and I think that there is a lot that is yet to be learned here.  However I believe that Seth has presented a reasonable and quite plausible theory.  What we do know is that the body is a complex machine that can adapt better than any machine known to man.  Therefore I have a hard time believing that A) the body won't somehow adapt itslef in response to eating "zero set point" foods over the course of a lifetime, and B) that eating only a fraction of your calories as "zero set point" food will have that strong of an appetite suprressing effect (in the near and long term).    But hey what do I know, I have not thought about this nearly as much as Seth.

[jam]

I haven’t really changed my eating habits too much. I was counting calories before SLD and I continue today. I lost about 40 pounds with the calorie counting and exercise. I have only been doing SLD for 7 days and lost 3.4 pounds more. That is a little more than usual, but not out of the ordinary.

The oil has replaced my mid-morning and afternoon snacks, which usually consisted of raw fruits and vegetables. Now I need to work those missing raw foods into my lunch and dinners. I log my food and exercise online and have noticed that the percent of fat in my diet has increase from the oil.

[mjohnson121]

Protein Enginner:

Good points. I like the idea of being a fair skeptic and being willing to experiment rather than a dismissive skeptic (which many seem to be these days). As far as adapting to the diet over a period of time, it sounds possible. Although Seth has been on it for 5 years so far...it sounds like the adaptation that occurs is just the slowing of the metabolism to match the new, lower weight.

Overall, I would assume that the only true "adaptation" of the body to the diet would have to occur as the gene pool evolves over generations, not within one organisms lifetime. Especially since if the diet theory of SLD is correct, then the genes we have today (and for the rest of our lives) will be expressed in that manner.

-Mark

[Echo]

I was dieting before SLD and lost some weight.  Unknowingly, I thought I was losing weight because I was being healthier by eating less meat and cooking with more vegetables.  In actuality, I was simply eating things every day that I had never really had before, with spices that were mostly new too.  I was doing the extra credit, basically.

Then I started SLD.  I've lost another few lbs, probably about 7 give or take.  Except now (and this is where I get back on topic), I've changed my eating habits again.  I've changed them back to eating what I really enjoy.

Sure, I've kept the vegetarian recipes that were great, but now I'm eating ice cream again, dessert at a nice restaurant, and just about anything else I want.  But I'm eating so much less each day that I continue to lose weight.

So have I changed my eating habits?  Yes, I have.  I'm back to truly enjoying what I eat.

[bonnie2315k]

Nope. No progress here.

For two weeks I've been consistently doing the following every weekday:

7:30 AM: small portion of fruit, juice, milk or cereal, small portion on getting up.
9:00: Light breakfast as I read my work email.
10:30 2 Tbsp sugar in water
12:00: lunch
3:30: 2 Tbsp sugar in water
7:00: dinner, sometimes Lean Cuisine, sometimes fattening.
Usually not hungry for rest of evening but once or twice have taken sugar water.

Results: NONE!

I am able to use the sugar water as a substitute for the unhealthy snacks I was eating in midmorning and midafternoon. But of course, there is no caloric savings. My appetite at other times of day is unchanged. My weight is unchanged.

Snake oil if you ask me. I was suspicious from the beginning and it looks like I was right to be.

[SFC]

Bonnie,

Sorry to hear you haven't had any results.  I have no vested interest in the outcome of the book, and can speak only from my personal experience.  I tried the SLD early on before I had even heard there was going to be a book.  My experience -- and I am by nature very skeptical, and I actually had negative expectations going in -- has been very much as Seth describes his experience and as the many people who have also had a good outcome.  I really do think there is something to this, and ultimately time, the anecdotal experiences of many, and perhaps a clinical trial down the road will be the arbiters.  That said, I think it is quite possible, if not obvious, that different people have different physiologies and, as is often the case in medicine, a drug that works for the majority may not work for the all.

[SFC]

Bonnie,

Also, a couple of suggestions from my experience. 

1.  For me, I was doing 500 cal of fructose water early in the going, which is about 11 tablespoons.  Try increasing the dose, and if you don't want to have THAT much sugar, try the oil, but in either case, upping the dose would be worth trying.

2. I found much better results if I did the flavorless calories (oil or sugar water) as the first 500 calories of my day.  In general, once I started eating tasty food, I was more inclined to want more of that throughout the day vs. having all of my flavorless calories up front.  Maybe psychological but that was my experience.

3.  Very late in the game (about 2 weeks ago), I started doing one of the things Seth suggested in the extra credit chapter of the book, which was to vary the flavor of the regular foods I was adding by adding random spices to everything I ate.  Good God (!) did my appetite decrease dramatically.  Whereby I had been having about 750 calories before dinner, and maybe 1,800 for the day (my maintenance calorie level is 2,200 to 2,400 w/o exercise factored in), it dropped to 200 - 300 before dinner and maybe 1,400 to 1,500 for the day.  It was as marked as the initial results I had with just the sugar water.

Finally, Seth noted in that his very small "experiement" with a few other adopters, one took 7 weeks before he saw the effect.

[Seth Roberts]

Bonnie, what is your height and weight?

[digbyde]

If Bonnie is forty or older, in perimenopause or menopause, there's a good likelihood that hormones are a factor. Her diet is fairly high in carbohydrates, and I had to get more protein and less sugar/starch before my weight would budge.  Other women friends found that after years of being lean, and dropping weight readily, that once they hit that time of fluctuating hormones they had a miserable time with weight gain and loss. (Suzanne Somers deals with this in one of her books, and uses food combining as the main thrust. My neighbor read the Somer's book, got on HRT and dropped thirty pounds.)  The point is the cravings, which are caused by fluctuating hormones, and women have more dancing around than just insulin which is the biggest culprit.

[tekayla]

Bonnie

Sorry you are feeling like this, but you should try the oil before you give up on it completely. The sugar water didn't work for me, in fact it made me ravenous. I think some people are more successful on the oil. Your choice but worth a try I think.

Cheers, Kayla

[carlo]

There are so many interesting paradoxes and ironies in this theory.  There must be weight loss studies in which researchers tested some appetite-supressing drug against what they assumed to be an inert placebo---a sugar pill. 

[bonnie2315k]

1. I would love to try the oil but it is just not an option for me, period. I am too sensitive to the texture and it grosses me out. I have to have oil WITH something, like on a salad. I used lots of oils on my skin but I can't eat them straight.

2. I am 39, 5'5" and about 230 pounds, having gone up from about 160 in the past 12 years. Yes, I used to be someone who could go on slim-fast for a month and easiy drop 10 pounds or so, now not only does nothing work, it gets worse without me doing anything.

3. One physical challenges are lifelong exercise-induced asthma which prevents INTENSE cardiovascular exercise, but not walking, bike riding, etc. which I have always done lots of. Basically I can't run more than a few hundred yards, or walk up more than a few flights of stairs.

4. For about 12 years I've had high blood pressure starting at age 27 (when at my lowest weight and it doesn't change with my weight). This is genetic.

5. Hormones: I have been in fertility treatment for several years, including two IVF cycles last spring, which involves major artificial hormones, and the results were a chemical pregnancy and a late-first-trimester miscarriage. Of course this has played havoc with my hormones but I've just completed an intensive "recurrent miscarriage" workup before proceeding with more treatments. I've been checked for many hormonal autoimmune problems including thyroid issues and diabetes, complete lipid profile, and an endometrial biopsy (to test the hormone levels and other things in my uterus in the second half of my menstrual cycle). All normal. I doubt this is relevant but the only thing out of the ordinary was a marker my cardio said was indicative of an inflammatory condition... which there is, a back problem that may have originated in an injury and is threatening to become osteoarthritis.

6. I had the D&C in July and since then my weight has been even more difficult to maintain (and yes I am aware of depression, etc. but that is over... I could tell the difference). A complication is that I had to switch BP meds for the pregnancy and what I was given was not very effective. In the months after the pregnancy we were still keeping that drug but my BP skyrocketed. Now I am taking cardizem and since then have actually gained weight, while increasing my physical activity.

7. My only dietary problem excess eating sweets. My meals are healthy and low glycemic, I find this easy to maintain. The only benefit I see so far with SLD is that I am no longer craving these particular sweets. But of course I am not saving the calories and am not losing weight.

[Miller]

There are so many interesting paradoxes and ironies in this theory.  There must be weight loss studies in which researchers tested some appetite-supressing drug against what they assumed to be an inert placebo---a sugar pill. 

LOL, I made a similar analogy on my blog this morning.

[Seth Roberts]

Bonnie,

What about taking the oil with water (and perhaps sugar)? That seems to work for some people. I think some details are in the Straight/No Chaser thread.

[GilbertZ]

Snake oil if you ask me. I was suspicious from the beginning and it looks like I was right to be.

Bonnie,

While I'm sorry for the issues you are having, I'd like to point out that your statement was rather rude. You are insulting the author of this site who has been cordial, and you are insulting all the people here who are succeeding, because if it's snake oil, then the testimonials are lies.

That said, I can understand that in your frustration, you might have said some things hopefully you don't mean... If you look at things in a positive light, you might realize that there is actually hope for some good results. After analyzing what you've said, I believe this to be the case for you...

You clearly have lots of things going on. Seth's diet works for people who have a particular type of fat setpoint issue. If your hormones are causing weight gain, the diet may not help you at all. The drugs too can cause you problems. Cardizem causes fluid retention. That means the initial water weight that dieting tends to cause will likely not "show" for you. It may take you 2 months to notice anything working.  Hard to get motivation to keep going when you don't see results. But that will be the same no matter what you try...

After reading your history, the ONLY benefit I would expect you to see is reduced appetite. Which you have indicated has occurred. Therefore this diet IS working for you, you simply haven't taken advantage of it. You would have to work a bit harder than most while you are on the drug, but if you use the reduced appetite to reduce caloric intake, you will lose weight. As the weight comes off, the blood pressure should come down too...so hopefully you can reduce the dose of Cardizem. Which will reduce the fluid retention. Which will make dieting easier. Which will hopefully let you get off Cardizem altogether. Which can help with so many other issues.

But whatever you do, make sure you are keeping your Dr. apprized of what you're doing, because hormones and drug interactions in what you describe are real complicated.